Make that 8 Republican State Senators not supporting SB5

Basically you are stating that the misery that has been brought upon the middle class in the private sector – elimination of pensions, erosion of pay and benefits, etc…needs to be spread to everyone. Misery, after all, loves company.

Don’t bother looking at study after study that states government workers are not overcompensated, just keep stating as a fact that they are. Remain jealous of the pensions some in the public sector get, while refusing to fight for a better situation for yourself, trusting in the “free market” or some 401(k) shenanigans to provide for you in retirement. Keep on truckin’ down that road, even though it is becoming increasingly obvious that there actually is no road anymore.

The middle class is not a natural outgrowth of capitalism, it had to be fought for inch by inch, mainly by unions. But Fox and talk radio apparently have twisted your mind so much that you now blame unions for your own demise. That’s some mighty strong propoganda they got flowin’ over there.

So I guess CEOs making tens of millions of dollars (even when they suck) while you have to eat mac & cheese and ramen noodles to make ends meet is okey dokey with you.

Corporations, like it or not, do not exist for the purpose of employing the maximum number of individuals, at the maximum possible wage, with lifetime pay and benefits after a certain period of time. Yes – the percentage of executive pay is outrageous. But even if you mandated a limit on CEO pay, it wouldn’t come close to fixing the unfunded obligations of these public union employees. There is no CEO in the public sector to blame. The equation simply does not work.

So mandate that everyone has to give theirAmerican hard earned money to those who don’t actually work for their own success and deny everyone the choice to actually give from the heart and pat everyone on the back for halfheartedly giving. Giving comes from the heart and if you don’t give ful heartedly there is no reason to give other than self justification and not being held accountable for anything you don’t do. Which is actually truly care for others…hmmmm, no thanks…it starts with one just as it did 2000 years ago…Jesus

Who’s going to pay for your kids to attend k-12 when the public no longer funds them?

Um, public schools, police departments, state prisons, and fire departments arent’ charities!

You’d better add Senator Daniels to the wobbly-support list. Here’s his quote from a town meeting in his district: “On Senate Bill 5, I will support reform in some fashion. Having said that, I hope that parties from all sides will come together and work to find a common ground. Otherwise, with or without changes, I am going to support Senate Bill 5 [...] Is Senate Bill 5 the answer? I don’t know. But, I do know that some changes need made, and these decisions aren’t going to be easy ones.”

Joining him was State Rep John Carey, who went further: “In its present form, I do not support the bill”

Also, public employees paid for their entire working career into their pension fund — and did NOT pay social security and are not eligible for it. So no one else’s money is paying for their pensions — but a lot of other peoples’ money will be paying for services to keep them out of abject poverty if the greedy wealthy are allowed to steal their pensions. They ARE the middle class, and a respectable pension they have funded for themselves is NOT a “utopian fantasy for a select group”? You need to lose that brainwashed bitterness because the people who have pounded it into you are the ones taking your money from your pocket — not public sector workers.

Ah, but defined benefit pensions DID work for most everyone, management as well as labor, for several years, until the 1990s. At that time, the private sector began replacing defined benefit pension plans with defined contribution plans or even no plans, and people like yourself let it happen.

The demise of defined benefit pension plans lags just slightly behind the demise of private sector unions. Strange, isn’t it?

The Republicans also want no middle class – just a select group of corporate brahmins like Johnny K. overseeing a vast group of minimum wage slaves.

And clueless peeps like Fumanchoo are helpoing them achieve their goal.

The math of Ohio’s public pension system is fine. The changes they recommend – making people work 32 years instead of 30 and making slight changes to the calculations for determining the benifits will be enough to keep the fund solvent. Just as social security could very easily be fixed by raising the cutoff for contribution. But we can’t do that because we cannot tax our sacred wealthy populace as they are superior beings who simply cannot be bothered with trivial matters like national solvency. That is for the little people.

You clearly do not understand how the pension fund works. Employees pay into it (a higher percentage than people pay into social security) and the state contributes (just as a private employer contributes to social security). The money is invested by the fund in various equities, bonds and such. There are strict rules governing the amounts of money that must be on hand. It is a good system and the money is managed conservatively by the handlers of the fund.

I don’t understand why you hate it so much. Jealousy is the only reason I see.

Well… I’m not union. No one in my immediate family is union. I pay 100% of my health insurance and I *adamantly* support folks’ right to collective bargaining. If state, county and city administrators have been so inept at negotiations that they’ve promises they can’t keep it’s time for new ones. Let’s not place the burden of our governments’ screw-ups on the backs of hard-working workers!

See, I read those comments and said he would vote yes. I thought Carey was more clearer.

I just want to know why it is the union employees and their families are singled out here to pay the piper??? We aren’t driving around in Porsches or Lamborghinis. These unfunded obligations you speak of WERE fully funded until the CEOs and CFOs of your blessed corporations decided that 40% was not good enough and they wanted 400%, and got caught when the banks went in the toilet. SB 5 is not about money (in print), it’s about employee rights. No one put a gun to the Corp CEOs head when they “negotiated” the contracts that currently exist. Before China started undercutting everything we make here, everbody was happy. Now, in order the “breach the contract” with impunity, they have to get rid of the rules. Careful what you wish for; if this goes through, non-union pay scales are going to drop like a rock, too

You’re not aware of my thought, or the issues or history of my State. Thanks for visiting.

This isn’t Greece. Now you just being silly. You obvious don’t think for yourself. You’re just coming here an recycling the talking points you hear on talk radio and Fox News. Pity. Enjoy the New Mexico weather, sockpuppet.

No it does matter. Just because it doesn’t fit your talking points doesn’t make it irrelevant.

I know what the average teachers salary is. Underpaid. I couldn’t do what the average teacher does, and I tried. I bet 85% of the general
population couldn’t either. Just curious: do you put in any time volunteering with a group of kids? Scouts, Sunday School, future conservatives of America? I’m just trying to ascertain if you have any point of reference on how difficult it is to guide a group of children.

Huh? House Republicans controlled the Ohio House for 14 years until 2008, when Democrats netted seven seats to seize control by a 53-46 advantage. Also, take a look who has been in the governors mansion. Hear of Voinovich? Taft?

Get informed.

Jealousy?

What do you call this in your own words!!!

“we cannot tax our sacred wealthy populace as they are superior beings who simply cannot be bothered with trivial matters like national solvency. That is for the little people.”

The question I must ask is…..why are you so Jealous of the so called “rich”? Hum?

You got the balls to throw rocks but not the stones to use your real name. How weak and sorry you are. It is precisely tea baggers like yourself that unions are galvanizing, and becoming stronger. Thanks, we appreciate that. And good luck with that non-union job. When you get fired for being on this blog rather than working, don’t come cry to the unions.

You got the balls to throw rocks but not the stones to use your real name. How weak and sorry you are. It is precisely tea baggers like yourself that unions are galvanizing, and becoming stronger. Thanks, we appreciate that. And good luck with that non-union job. When you get fired for being on this blog rather than working, don’t come cry to the unions.

It is disheartening to hear your position about unions. I too worked for a private organization and felt that I had no voice. Maybe that is why you are a little frustrated–you have no voice. Protect yourself and get unionized! Contrary to many beliefs about unionized workers having elite priviledges, it is actually large business corporation, and lets not forget Wall St. that exploit their workers instead of valuing all of the hard work and sacrifices we make to line their pockets. Unions fight for police officers to have bulletproof vests and class sizes for teachers. These are important occupational features that people often do not hear about. Do you really want 40 kids in one classroom attempting to learn? Or how about your brother, cousin or brother that has to purchase their own bulletproof vest because of “budget cuts”–providing they can actually afford it on the salary of an officer.
Am I bias? Maybe. It could be that I have been exploited and I have seen the negative effects first hand.
Try to be objective and look at both sides. It is unfortunate that you and your fellow coworkers are not unionized. I feel for, really I do. But maybe you should redirect your energy at the real enemy. Google the Koch brothers. You will be alarmed!!